Tanta, quanta

john abshire

Well-Known Member

  • Patronus

Illud ornamentum non tam pulchrum est quam hoc, neque illa gemma tanta est quanta haec.

That jewelry is not so beautiful as this, and that gem is not so much as this (that gem is not as expensive as this).
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Pacifica

grammaticissima

  • Aedilis

Location:
Belgium
Ornamentum is (in this case and most usually) a piece of jewelry, not jewelry collectively.

The second part is "and that gem isn't as large as this one". If it were about expensiveness, you'd have genitives of value: neque illa gemma tanti est quanti haec.
 

john abshire

Well-Known Member

  • Patronus

Ornamentum is (in this case and most usually) a piece of jewelry, not jewelry collectively.

The second part is "and that gem isn't as large as this one". If it were about expensiveness, you'd have genitives of value: neque illa gemma tanti est quanti haec.
Are “genitives of value” the grammar term for how one (always) turns a quantity into an expense? And otherwise the quantity means size?

I guessed that Tanta….quanta meant “as much as”; literally I got “such an amount….so much”; and I thought that quam was used for “as” in comparisons; e.g. tanta…quam “such an amount as”. Is quam not used in this way?
 

Pacifica

grammaticissima

  • Aedilis

Location:
Belgium
Are “genitives of value” the grammar term for how one (always) turns a quantity into an expense? And otherwise the quantity means size?
I guessed that Tanta….quanta meant “as much as”; literally I got “such an amount….so much”
The neuter forms tantum... quantum used substantively (i.e. as if they were nouns themselves rather than in agreement with another noun) mean "as much as" (literally "as much... how much"). For example: Tantum edi quantum volui = "I ate as much as I wanted". When these same forms are put in the genitive, but again without modifying a noun, they convey price or value. E.g. Tanti domum vendidi quanti volui = "I sold the house for as much as I wanted"; Haec domus tanti est quanti illa = "This house is worth as much as that one (a bit more literally: is of as much [value] as that one)".

When the corresponding adjective forms are used as regular adjectives in agreement with a noun, like tanta and quanta in your example, then the translation more often involves words like "large", "big" or "great" rather than "much" (though there are exceptions).
I thought that quam was used for “as” in comparisons; e.g. tanta…quam “such an amount as”. Is quam not used in this way?
Quam is used for "as" principally when the correlative is tam. E.g. Marcus tam fortis est quam Gaius = "Marcus is as brave as Gaius."

The correlative to tantus (and all its forms) is usually quantus (and all its forms) rather than quam. Similarly, the correlative to tot is quot (tot... quot = "as many... as"). Yet another example of a common correlative pair is talis... qualis = "such... as", "of the same kind... as". In sum, the English "as" in the second part of the comparison can translate in many different ways (quam, quantus, quot, qualis, etc.), depending on what comes before it (whether it's "as much" or "as many" or "such" etc.).
 
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