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Nature is conducted by copper

Agnellus

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Location:
Mundus Novus
Hello all, I am here with another translation, and my attempt at it. Firstly I'd like to thank you all again for your help!

English:
Through copper nature is conducted,
By iron nature is governed,
From water nature springs forth/is born
Through fire nature is reborn whole*

*This line is drawn from the Rosicrucian motto "igne natura renovatur integra." Thus I intend to keep the line as it is, it being a verified historical translation. However, I have conjugated the verb from the present to the imperfect to better suit the stanza...in which the actions are emphasized as a continual process. Does this make proper use of the imperfective?

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Latin:
Cupro natura conducebatur
Ferro autem** natura regebatur
Ex aqua natura nascebatur
Igni autem natura renovabatur integra

**I have used autem to emphasize contrast. However, I am uncertain about the placement. Any suggestions?


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Just to clarify again, this is not a machine translation! It may not be a correct translation, but I would not insult you with a machine-translation; this is my own attempt.

Thank you again!
 

Callaina

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- Can you explain a bit about what you mean by "conducted"?
- Imperfect only indicates ongoing action in the past, not the present: you've written "nature was being conducted by copper", etc.
- Cupro doesn't exist (at least according to L&S). "By copper" = aere.
- I would save the autem for the final line.
 

Agnellus

New Member

Location:
Mundus Novus
- Can you explain a bit about what you mean by "conducted"?
- Imperfect only indicates ongoing action in the past, not the present: you've written "nature was being conducted by copper", etc.
- Cupro doesn't exist (at least according to L&S). "By copper" = aere.
- I would save the autem for the final line.

- Conducted as in be lead through...the stanza uses alchemical allegory, but I decided on the use of conducted because copper, as a metal, is very conductive of electricity.
- Thank you for the correction here!
- Despite the possible dubious nature of wiktionary, that's where I found cupro, ablative of cuprum. My (light) research provides the etymology as from the Greek Κύπρος (Cyprus), where the were well known for their copper resources.
- So, saving autem for the last line would be to remove it from the second, yet keep the placement it has in the last line?

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I do have two more lines, and I promise to end it with that.

Embrace Venus (Amplectere Venerem)
Surrender to Mars (Dedere ad Martem)

Venus and Mars can be either the God/Goddess or the planets, but from what I have seen that would not change the structure.
 

Callaina

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- Conducted as in be lead through...the stanza uses alchemical allegory, but I decided on the use of conducted because copper, as a metal, is very conductive of electricity.
Conduco doesn't seem to have quite that meaning in Classical Latin (more like "lead together"); perduco or just duco might be better.

- Despite the possible dubious nature of wiktionary, that's where I found cupro, ablative of cuprum. My (light) research provides the etymology as from the Greek Κύπρος (Cyprus), where the were well known for their copper resources.
L&S lists it only in adjectival form (cyprius = "of copper"): http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:1999.04.0059:entry=Cyprus1

- So, saving autem for the last line would be to remove it from the second, yet keep the placement it has in the last line?
Yes.

Embrace Venus (Amplectere Venerem)
Surrender to Mars (Dedere ad Martem)
Dedere Marti; other than that, it looks good.
 

Agnellus

New Member

Location:
Mundus Novus
Conduco doesn't seem to have quite that meaning in Classical Latin (more like "lead together"); perduco or just duco might be better.
Okay! I shall put the stanza below, revised with your recommendations!



So aere is the ablative of aes? This book cites aes as meaning crude metal, base metal, copper. The collection of meanings would actually work well for my meaning.

Also, thank you for verifying and correcting the last bit I posted!

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Here is the revised version:

Aere natura perducitur
Ferro natura regitur
Ex aqua natura nascitur
Igni autem natura renovatur integra

Amplectere Venerem!
Dedere Marti!
 

Callaina

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Maybe just ducitur, on second thought (perducitur looks a bit odd without a thing it's being led through/to).

The rest looks good. You're welcome! :)
 

Agnellus

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Location:
Mundus Novus
Thank you so much for your speedy help!! :)

I do have a question about aes, however. I am seeing that although it means base metal, copper, and bronze, most dictionaries have listed the first meaning as money or fee...now, my guess would be that the use of aes to refer to money would be a colloquialism, like how green is a colloquialism for money, but chiefly denotes the colour green; naturally they would have had a word for copper before they had a term for money. Also strengthening this theory is that pecunia appears to be the main term for money.

However, I have come across the word aeramen (ablative aeramine), meaning copper/bronze. What are your thoughts? Would this word more specifically reference copper? I only ask because the line would take an undesired meaning if there was a double entendre alluding to nature being led by money.
 

Callaina

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I haven't seen it before and it seems rare, but I don't see why it shouldn't work.
 

Agnellus

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Location:
Mundus Novus
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