Latin bible

[kev67]

I am thinking of ordering a Latin bible. Not that I intend to read all of it, just the good bits. I am not very interested in the geneologies, Jewish law, or the prophets. Internet informs me there is a version called The Vulgate. Is there something special about this? Are all Latin bibles called the Vulgate?

 

[Terry S.]

The Vulgate is the translation of the Scriptures translated by St. Jerome and was the official version of the bible of the Catholic Church until the Nova Vulgata came out some decades ago. For cultural reasons, I'd say that Jerome's Vulgate is the one to go for. Go canny with your money. There should be plenty of second-hand copies to buy out there if you shop carefully.

 

[Avunculus H]

The Vulgate text is available online; this is only one of the options. But I understand if you prefer a text on paper; I'm old-fashioned that way, too.

 

[kev67]

The Vulgate text is available online; this is only one of the options. But I understand if you prefer a text on paper; I'm old-fashioned that way, too.

I'd prefer it on papyrus, but I suppose that is difficult to get hold of.

 

[Laurentius]

I'd prefer it on papyrus, but I suppose that is difficult to get hold of.

You can always transcribe on it. If you ever do remember to show us.

 

[kev67]

My copy of the Biblia Sacra Vulgata has arrived
It seems to have some apocryphal books. For example, in the King James Version it goes Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Job. In the Biblia Sacra Vulgata it goes Liber Ezrae, Tobiae, Iudith, Hester, Iob.

Which reminded me of my favourite passage from Waverley by Sir Walter Scott:

Such was the situation of matters, when the pedlar missing, as he said, a little doggie which belonged to him, began to halt and whistle for it. This repeated more than once gave offence to the rigour of his companion, the rather because it appeared to indicate inattention to the treasures of theological and controversial knowledge which he was pouring out for his edification. He therefore signalled gruffly, that he could not waste his time in waiting for a useless cur.

“But if your honour wad consider the case of Tobit”---

“Tobit!” exclaimed Gilfillan, with great heat; “Tobit and his dog both are altogether heathenish and apocryphal, and none but a prelatist or a papist would draw them into question.
I doubt I ha;’e been mista’en in you, friend”

“Very like,” answered the pedlar, with great composure, “but ne’ertheless I shall take leave to whistle again upon poor Bawty.”

 

[Bestiola]

My copy of the Biblia Sacra Vulgata has arrived
It seems to have some apocryphal books.

Hope you'll enjoy your purchase! Speaking of apocryphal books, I wonder if one can buy somewhere gospel of Thomas and other similar texts.

 

[kev67]

I am getting close to the end of Genesis. Still finding it rather tricky. So tricky indeed I bought an English Bible, although that will not help me with the apocryphal chapters.

 

[Terry S.]

I am getting close to the end of Genesis. Still finding it rather tricky. So tricky indeed I bought an English Bible, although that will not help me with the apocryphal chapters.

Had you bought a Catholic Bible it would. The Douay-Rheims is the best for working with the Vulgate, since it is a translation of the Vulgate and not the Greek and Hebrew originals. Later versions of the D-R were revised with an eye to the original languages.

 

[kev67]

Had you bought a Catholic Bible it would. The Douay-Rheims is the best for working with the Vulgate, since it is a translation of the Vulgate and not the Greek and Hebrew originals. Later versions of the D-R were revised with an eye to the original languages.

That is interesting to know.

 

[Clemens]

Try this site, it has the Vulgate with Douay-Reims and the Authorized Version.

A minor point: the New Testament is not a translation by Jerome, but a revision of the Vetus Latina by him (the Gospels) and others (everything else). The Old Testament is a translation from the Hebrew, or Aramaic of Greek in some cases. There are two versions of Jerome's Psalms, one based on the Septuagint and one on the Hebrew. Some of the Apocrypha are identical with the Vetus Latina.

 

[kev67]

Nearly at the end of Genesis. Only chapter 50 to go. Even in the NIV of the Bible the language is a little unusual, which I suppose makes it harder in Latin. What was going on in chapter 49? Jacob was a very ornery man in his old age. I have started studying Old English, and coincidentally some of the texts have been about Joseph and his brothers. I don't know what Anglo-Saxons imagined camels and myrrh to be (come to think of it, I do not know what myrrh is myself). I bought the Old English Heptateuch. Joy of joys, it has a Latin translation under the Old English texts, so I can practise both, once I get a bit better at Old English.

 

[Avunculus H]

(come to think of it, I do not know what myrrh is myself)

Wikipedia to the rescue

 

[kev67]

I have started reading the Book of Tobit. Clemen's link is very helpful. I do not see any reason why it should have been considered apocryphal, but I have only read two chapters. I have not got to the bit with the dog.

 

[Clemens]

Biblical texts are considered apocryphal (non-canonical or secondarily canonical), generally by Protestants, are those which are found in the Septuagint but not the Hebrew canon, broadly speaking.

 

[kev67]

I have reached a bit where a dog is mentioned - chapter 6 verse 1:
profectusque est Tobias et canis secutus est eum et mansit prima mansione iuxta fluvium Tigris
The dog is not mentioned again in the chapter. I wonder whether he ever will be again. Also slightly odd is that this is Tobias junior, not Tobias senior. There are two Tobiases in the Book of Tobit.

Biblical texts are considered apocryphal (non-canonical or secondarily canonical), generally by Protestants, are those which are found in the Septuagint but not the Hebrew canon, broadly speaking.

In your link to the Latin Vulgate Bible, the English translation looks like it is in the style of the King James Version, but the Book of Tobit does not appear in the King James Version, and it is considered apocryphal by Protestants anyway. IIRC the Septuagint was written in Greek. So I suppose both the Latin version and the 17th Century English version were both translated from the Greek version. I am guessing the English translators would have based their translations on the Hebrew text where they existed; otherwise on the Greek texts. Sometimes the English version is not quite the same as the Latin version, although it does read well.

 

[Pacifica]

In your link to the Latin Vulgate Bible, the English translation looks like it is in the style of the King James Version, but the Book of Tobit does not appear in the King James Version, and it is considered apocryphal by Protestants anyway.

The English there is from the Douay-Rheims, a Catholic Bible that was translated from the Vulgate.

 

[Clemens]

The King James originally included the Apocrypha as non-canonical but important. They were omitted during the Puritan period.

 

[kev67]

A dog appears in Tobit chapter 11 verse 9, but I am not sure whether it was the same dog from chapter 6.
tunc praecucurrit canis qui simul fuerat in via et quasi nuntius adveniens blandimento suae caudae gaudebat

 

[Pacifica]

This seems to suggest that it is the same dog:

canis qui simul fuerat in via