An old adage: seni supino colei culum tegunt
- Thread starter JaimeB
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Re: An old adage
I concede to that point - but mine still stands : P
I'm not saying "delete this" or something like that, I'm just saying that the phrase was more than I needed to see right when I woke up (I didn't reply until I got back from work).
I concede to that point - but mine still stands : P
I'm not saying "delete this" or something like that, I'm just saying that the phrase was more than I needed to see right when I woke up (I didn't reply until I got back from work).
Here is the link to the source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_profanity#Usage_2
To put it in context, this is the paragraph in which it is quoted and called a "folk saying":
"On the other hand, a Pompeian graffito quotes what may have been a folk saying: seni supino colei culum tegunt: "when an old man lies down, his balls cover his butthole." This may have been a proverb, and constitutes ribald humour; it does not demonstrate that the word was considered particularly obscene."
I am sorry if this was not the most pleasant image to wake up to, but I hadn't thought that someone might check this thread first thing in the morning.
At around the same time, I also posted four sayings of a much more elevated tone in the Latin Mottoes area. It's too bad you didn't look there first.
Sincere apologies for any offense I may have caused. I thought I was acting in the spirit of fun, but I see it may have been a rather adolescent male idea of fun...
To put it in context, this is the paragraph in which it is quoted and called a "folk saying":
"On the other hand, a Pompeian graffito quotes what may have been a folk saying: seni supino colei culum tegunt: "when an old man lies down, his balls cover his butthole." This may have been a proverb, and constitutes ribald humour; it does not demonstrate that the word was considered particularly obscene."
I am sorry if this was not the most pleasant image to wake up to, but I hadn't thought that someone might check this thread first thing in the morning.
At around the same time, I also posted four sayings of a much more elevated tone in the Latin Mottoes area. It's too bad you didn't look there first.
Sincere apologies for any offense I may have caused. I thought I was acting in the spirit of fun, but I see it may have been a rather adolescent male idea of fun...
Nah, it is fine. The moderating team has been discussing what should and should not go into the profanity forum, and the general consensus is, that as long it comes from an original Latin source OR involves a certain amount of wit, the phrase's existence in this forum is justified.
This conclusion has gotten the harpoon phrase axed, I am afraid.
This conclusion has gotten the harpoon phrase axed, I am afraid.
I had no idea they said such things about men. I thought this was the female prerogative *shifty*JaimeB dixit:
:roflred: 
Ok, but what's the real meaning of that saying, literal or something else?
It may have been inspired by the real sightseeing, enough to be put in verse - apparently, this endearing saying was put into iambic senarius.
(CIL IV, 4488)
98) CIL IV.4488 (iambic senarius) [House VI.13.19] [Courtney #82; Spal #15]
seni supino — sympathetic dat. (see ad 1824) supino — pred. (“when he is lying on his back”) colei — (pl.) scrotum [Adams 1982: 66-67] [trisyllabic]
[A rather unhappy image that recalls the Grk. λακκοσχέας (“man with hanging scrotum”), suggesting either profligacy (cf. Latin ecfututus) or, as here, the impotence of old age. The condition can be caused by a varicocele, which is mocked in the elderly at both Lucilius 331-32 and Juvenal 10.204-06.]
[This piece suggests that, like the Greeks, the Romans idealized the compact genitalia of the young man who was just coming of age (Grk. ephebe). The allusion to the man’s anus has no practical purpose but merely enhances the description’s gross specificity. (For a modern comic treatment of this theme, see Ricky Gervais, Humanity [2018] at 49:26 minutes.) Spal suggests that the piece might have been motivated by other nearby graffiti that have a distinctly homosocial cast and offers useful comments (153) re the manner in which it employs the form of a traditional maxim to challenge the reader to provide an interpretation.]
[Shackleton Bailey’s interpretation (Phoenix 32 [1978] 321-22) seems somewhat overly involved: “An old man, qua cinaedus, is undesirable, and, when lying on his back, inaccessible. All his colei are good for is to offer a protection which his culus does not need anyway, i.e., they are good for nothing.” Contrast Rhode (cited by Wick 222): “Eines Kommentars bedarf wol dieses freilich nicht besonders appetittiche Bild eines zuruckgelehnt (wol betrunken) daliegenden greisen λακκοσχέας nicht” (loosely: this grotesque image of a naked [and no doubt drunk] old man requires no commentary).]
From: A Sampling of Graffiti and Other Public and Semi-Public Texts from Pompeii and Herculaneum
E
Etaoin Shrdlu
Guest
If I were an ancient man, instead of an ancient woman, I'd be tempted to use λακκοσχέας as my custom title. Though quite frankly I've always regarded not having a scrotum of any description as one of the perks of womanhood. This has been confirmed by men I know with tales of being kicked there, or sitting on it.
Quidnam malī....?
@Bestiola This (from this compilation) is almost the same info as I've just read in this German edition (by the aforementioned Spal), only condensed. First of all, I think the double alliteration should be pointed out - the whole thing is very much in the Terentian tradition of memorable, timeless iambic one-liners. I personally think it's intended to be both an insult and a compliment. A compliment because a stretched ballsack offers protection against Priapic sexual advances. And an insult for obvious reasons. Thus it's a metaphor for old age, which can be unhappy but also gives protective wisdom. But most importantly it sounds like a maxim made worth contemplating and memorising for the fun of challenging others to provide an interpretation (also Spal's thoughts basically).
"At least my tits don't get jammed by elevator doors".
Sympathetic dative? Isn't it an ablative? Sene/seni
No, it's the dative object, the ablative would make no sense at all ("with the old man lying down, someone else's balls cover their ass"). Besides, the ablative is always sene I think (and the gen. pl. senum, never senium which is a neuter noun).